19 - Chris Soda

Transcript

so for example the size of mercury Rel you know just pick a planet random the

size of mercury for example related to the to the rotation period of Pluto we're talking about a physical

object you know the the the the size of a physical object and its and its movements they're not related well

they're related to their rotation around the Sun okay okay but and whatever else size related to size but size related to

movement that's not that's not a natural occurrence right across the board the

size and the motion and the movement you know the rotation period movement the orbital period movement and the sizes

movement you know physical physical movement movement all related together

in the same manner as we see in our own DNA and our own number system an

abstract number system I find that hard to understand as a natural process

Hello everybody welcome to the show uh I am Jason I'm here here with Dimitri hello everyone and uh we've got a guest

here today uh Chris soda is with us nice to meet you thank you guys nice to see

you again Jason yeah nice to see you so the story with this is Chris and I kind

of go way back he sort of rescued me I was actually talking about this with Demetri on the way down here uh we're in

Windsor by the way Windsor Ontario which is in Canada um the uh on on the way

down I was kind of just explaining kind of how we we were talking about like places we lived and everything in Windsor and it was I sort of mentioned

that you rescued me from a housing crisis that I had do you remember that where I was like homeless essentially

yeah yeah at that time I was uh you know I was a single dad uh and I had a spare room in my house uh and I knew Jason

from uh a coffee shop that I used to uh attend uh and um he seemed like a nice

guy so we got to talking we got to be uh you know pretty good friends he mentioned uh you know he might be

needing a place I said yeah you're welcome anytime so yeah I ended up staying for one year year and a half I

couldn't even remember like it had been a I just I remember sleeping on your floor comfortably for quite some time

yeah well I think you had the spare bedroom too right in if I remember maybe and then I think your daughter moved back or something was like on the floor

she'd have to visit her mom right so when she was gone you had the bedroom when she came back you had the floor yeah and I had the couch so it was not

my uh it was not my best uh moment well you know of living yeah but it was you

know the the you know the um I think you graduated or were graduating from University at that time so yeah I mean I

liked having young people you know around right so yeah we just kept up the association for all these years right

yeah yeah so that's quite the amazing beginning many conversations with Chris over the years on Politics on chess like

very good chess player and actually taught me quite a bit about it um and I'm a good solid mediocre uh 1200 player

but um one of the most interesting topics that I always found that we sort

of discuss you you know late at night and uh into the we hours of the morning is this um uh well how would you

describe it like alien intelligence and you I think first introduced me to that book by Colonel

Cory the day after waswell yes yeah and uh you know so this is a guy for those

of you who aren't familiar with the book like uh Corso was it Corso okay I cor yeah D Rono he wrote that basically on

his deathbed uh you know he he uh you know he published it uh you know pretty

close to the time that he died because I think he just wanted to get everything off his chest uh you know before he

passed away so yeah maybe you want to tell everybody what if they haven't seen the book or read it what it's a book

yeah so it's um it's uh well the book itself yeah I think stom Thurman did like uh the senator the famous

Republican senator did a forward to the book and they had no idea what it was going to be about it just kind of thought it was going to be about cuz

Corso was uh uh what is it Korea he did a lot of more famous for the P issue where you know U you know when the

Americans had sent uh soldiers to Vietnam a lot of them went missing uh

you know presumed de or actual PWS nobody knew Corso was one of those guys that you know hands on guy he was trying

to figure out where these where these Americans were and you know he found out for example that some of been sent to

China and and uh other places uh so he was more famous for that so people were quite surprised uh when when they found

out that they wrote a book that the actual topic of the book was something completely different uh which was that

he basically um was the point guy for hiding um evidence of this alien

intelligence specifically uh a spacecraft that had crash or landed uh

in the western us and it was his job to collect all the pieces uh and whatever

part of the of the space craft was still intact and then first of all to hide it

uh from public view so they came up with the weather balloon idea they still have that so this is the Roswell crash yes

well we think yeah actually not sure but we think it because we think there was a couple of crashes or there may have been

more than one right but you know in any case he he was in charge of one of those crafts uh of hiding one of those crafts

and then U they wanted to find out more about it but they were worried uh if they did the work exclusively in the US

and with only the pieces that they had intact that there's a chance for theft

or other people you know if you remember the nuclear power secrets from the

rosenbergs ETC had recently gone into you know Russian hands so people were worried that you know the same you know

the the officials were worried that the same thing could happen with the with this spacecraft right so this was in

late late late 40s early like Roswell cross was 47 or 48 right that's right just after World War II but you remember

the Rosenberg thing with the Spy right so you know the Cold War so a lot of

different times I mean a lot of people they have to always consider the contact so what he did basically was he he was Point guy I think for five different

presidents so they kept him on um because they didn't you know if if they if he had if a president was out and he

was out then another person would have to come in who would then have the same secrets that he had so he just kind of

decided to keep it with one guy yeah right so he ended up sending these pieces with this craft all over the world but not telling

anybody um you know where the craft came from he sent it to Italy or you know or Greece or somewhere in Canada so but he

sent it piece by piece check this piece here it tell us what you see and you know whatever and then eventually they

put it all together so yeah so that was quite the story but his public uh his Public Image was the P guy the point guy

he's trying to get the Americans who um were unaccounted for you know you know uh to to bring them back or to you know

have them properly buried or or whatever and I think a lot of it was he he would

sort of send bits of the technology to different American companies to kind of and around the world oh and around the

world okay with the idea of I thought it was with American companies just so he could kind of like promote American

interest by like okay we founded velcro for example well that's the long-term goal yeah but remember at you know when

he's setting these pieces around he didn't tell them what what what the what the end game was here said we have this

here could you tell us what it is a lot of it was University you didn't send it to you sent it to universities right around the world well by fragmenting it

you really obfuscating the entire like larger picture of what it is yeah he

just letting them focus on that one little natural small like that little piece right couldn't see the big picture

so if for example if the thing was as large as my coffee cup they they you know triy to take a piece off that and

then have it analyze and from that analysis they would figure out what the rest of the piece was so this this was

their their goal but again Cold War times um you know the uh there

were also a lot of UFO sightings at that time so a lot of people were reporting

um you know spacecraft or or or objects in the air Landing or this you know

there there are a number of power outages in the US brown outs as they call them related to so this whole issue

of U alien intelligence started to come to the to the you know the the potential

existence of Al intelligence come to the for and but the last you know when

people hear about this normally you would think it would be an astronomer uh a nuclear physicist you

know somebody who may have generally in their line of work have some interest on this topic nobody thought that a

military guy from from you know from the US Army who had you know none of that

kind of education all he would be in charge of this of this you know alien spacecraft program so right yeah so and

yeah so I guess first of all I would encourage everyone to read the book like it's an interesting book and the day

after Roswell yeah and but you're also so you're talking about I mean this is in his words I mean there's details and

certainly so you could you know you like um you know the guy literally did work I don't I can't remember the name of the

base he worked at but uh but he would but you know the timelines all add up

and you know it's a kind of a case of you know I think you could always conjecture you know he was um lying or

something like that or made have this story but he did sort of write it on his deathbed and there's certain yeah there

certain that's correct you're right that comes with that yeah there are certain uh points in the book that he kind of

mixes up the dates on it but remember he's like a you know not he's an older man and he's and he's not in good health

right uh and he had so much on his plate at the time you can imagine um so it's

you know it's understandable that he would maybe mess up a few details dates or or times or something but the general

overall view has never you know nobody's ever said um you know that that he made up the story I mean you know practically

speaking who the hell would make up a you know a story about this on their deathbed especially when they're known

for you know P issue right which is something yeah like your legacy is kind of secure at that point as yeah I'm not

going to be you know I'm sure he you know he not going to like make up something just yeah so yeah so so like

you said we talked about these kind of topics and then talked about other topics um and that eventually got me

interested into to checking you know when I got the time checking more uh into this myself and I found um I I have

to tell you like when I first started to look at this topic I came across something called Fibonacci numbers you

know Fibonacci Sequence golden mean uh all these sorts of terms right um but

the you know I checked a little more closely um and I found uh you know that

that that a lot of this stuff was more glitter uh and and uh fancy colors and

and and and uh you know extravagant displays uh you know you know artwork of

showing aliens and these you know magnificent looking crows right so but you when you when you crunch the nuts

and bolts and you get down to it one of the most common uh misperceptions on

this topic is that the f ACI sequence and Fibonacci numbers actually have some

mystical or mysterious value that's really not true um all right so yeah I

just okay so let's uh just zoom out a little bit and just kind of get some perspective so we we um so you wrote a

book in I think 2011 something like that yeah I think I finalized it 20 I think I

probably had the rough draft in 2009 or something but I actually finally yeah so

yeah and this book I think distilled a lot of the stuff you had been telling me

for years like um like and a lot of it and there's some new stuff and whatnot so the book I was just going to go

through a little bit just to get kind of give a synopsis of just the things that we're talking about so you mentioned the

so your book hollow hollow be Hollow be the name is the name of the book um and

some of the some of the uh stuff you mentioned was with the numbers I'm

surprised to hear you say so the Fibonacci SE when like so that's the just so everybody has a perspective so

this is this idea of so Fibonacci is used in like I don't know I I I use it

well trading like stock trading like the Fibonacci numbers are like kind of key places where you'll see this or at least

the perception is that um you know those are areas of support or resistance for buying and selling stocks um and so

people like Traders will use this thing just like a template or something yeah they'll take the the low and the high of

the stock and then they'll find the Fibonacci area within it and be like okay that's this line that's where

there's likely to be some action and you don't know if it's a self-fulfilling prophecy or what it is but whatever that's how they use it but it's it's all

over nature like you said the golden mean like in and well anyway why don't you go ahead why don't you go ahead and problem so you know a lot of people when

they when they think about the topic of alien intelligence and uh you know were we visited by uh aliens from from other

places uh and you know we we can kind of uh put a parameter on on that term Al

intelligence we can include this to be God or Gods also you know like you know a God or a Gods it's the same thing

whether it's a spiritual alien intelligence or a physical one or both you know the the whole point is you know

are we alone um and is everything Happening Here uh quote unquote naturally uh the biggest jokes or or or

some kind of design so of course like you mentioned u a lot of people talk about U the Fibonacci sequence with

designs but the actual truth is is that okay so for I think many a lot of

viewers might know it or could easily check it it's start you know the Fibonacci sequence is a is a series of

numbers uh that begin with zero U and one and then the line continues by

adding the last two numbers together to get the next number in the line so in the case of the Fibonacci SE sequence it

would be zero and then one and then Z and one added together to give you another one and then one and one added

together to give you two and then one and two added together to give you three and so forth up the line right uh so

this is you know known as a fibon NAA sequence and on the internet and in in other places you'll often hear that

these numbers are special numbers the zero the one the two the three the five

you know eight all the different numbers okay but the actual fact is you can start with any numbers first of all you

don't need 01 you can put 210 39 uh 610

one quarter I mean you could you know minus 4 and 8 whatever two numbers you as long as it's not Z 0 because

obviously you can't add zero and zero together to get another number unless maybe you're a politician but otherwise

like an actual but what do these numbers try to achieve what do they try to indicate okay so the the what are they

pointing towards okay so the people who uh in the case of the Fibonacci sequence they believe uh first of all that these

numbers themselves are special so the actual zero the start the line for example and then the actual one and then

the actual uh one again then the two so these actual numbers have some sort of value so the twos and threes and fives

are special numbers uh more than other numbers are special okay okay because of

other those other numbers are not part of the fiin sequence but the truth is any number you can do this with you can

start with any two numbers and add them together to get the third number and then the last two to get the four and so

on and so forth there's no there's nothing mystical me but well so meaning

that like so with the Fibonacci eventually you go down the line and everything if you're if you're dividing for example two by yeah okay yeah yeah

so okay so so first you know on the topic of the actual numbers so the Fibonacci numbers or the Fibonacci

sequence has nothing to do with those special numbers it can be any numbers to

start with okay the second point is like you say once you make your number line so many numbers long you go back to the

beginning and instead of adding to get your next number this time you divide

your results so in the case of the Fibonacci sequence you would have 0 1 is your first two numbers so 0 divid by 1

that's zero and then the next number would be 1 0 1 1 so 1 divid by one would be one eventually you divide up the line

and you start out with uh random you start out with random chaos results

different answers and then you get a smoothing out period and then you get a final constant

of 618 and it doesn't matter which two numbers you use it works with the

Fibonacci sequence or any other sequence that's constructed the same way so

there's nothing right away for the viewers if you see something on the Internet that says the Fibonacci

sequence uh the special Fibonacci numbers it's like turn a page on that one cuz that's that's but the Final

Destination has some weight to it that there is is a final constant number that has correct special meaning that's

correct doesn't matter how you get there but the the final result is the 618 what

we need to be looking at that's right does this go just to divert it might be if it's completely the wrong does this go anywhere into like Nicola Tesla and

once you know 36 and nine you understand the universe the vibrations does this go anywhere in that realm um I think it

could be part of it but I think the m u you know as as I talk about you know in

in the in the book that I wrote um second book that I wrote uh the the the

the the issue is or or the or the or the constant here is is a 618 in our number

system like you said if you set up the numbers in that manner any numbers starting with in that manner you'll get

to 618 and then the other thing I just want to mention quickly is once you set

that line up and you divide up to get 618 you can also divide down towards

your starting point to get 1.618 so those are the two constants in our number system um

and that has to do with the relationship to physical objects and for me that's

the fascinating part and the first indication that we um have been

interfaced by extraterrestrial intelligence that's the first indication

is that the physical world is matching the symbolic world I mean you know I I

can't um I've got one coffee in my hand but I can't show you a one or a five I I

need to have a physical object to correlate it to so the numbers themselves are just abstract thoughts

I've heard that before like you can you can have the abstract like 1 plus 1 equals two but it doesn't make two you

don't have two in your just I me S well I mean I don't know concept but it's

like a it's like a manifesting into the actual world right that's it but you need the physical objects in order for

those abstract thoughts to make any sense you know the the first thing I noticed uh you know checking uh myself

and you know I'm I'm checking because I've got the same interest that everybody else has uh you know are are

there you know life forms or whatever you want to call them from from other worlds coming here or have they come

here or are they here now you know the whole General concept of you know we are alone or we are not alone um you know I

I I start to dig a little deeper into it but like I mentioned earlier the problem was um there aren't a lot of books written

on this topic per se but there's a lot of social media content on this and a

lot of it is bogus so I decided to do my own checks and I I just took it upon

myself uh to take all the numbers that I could think of put them out you know and see if there was any kind of pattern or

relationship that I could see first off so we saw all UF you know we've seen all the UFO reports and UFO photos UFO

videos you know we saw a lot of this this is how most people first get introduced to this topic of extr tral

intelligence or the potential for extr tral intelligence but you know I happen to have enough time in my life that I

could go a little deeper and rather than looking at at pictures or photos or or

third party reports I decided to check some of the stuff myself uh so I just I

took the numbers and I started to Crunch the numbers um and I found I found uh

some interesting patterns uh I said okay let's let's look a little more here I started to check a little

more um and I started to play with numbers just along the lines of the

Fibonacci sequence but instead of starting with a zero and a one I just pulled you know two numbers out of my

butt and I and I said let's see if it works with this and it did I got the same sequence that the so-called special

Fibonacci Sequence got and I said well that maybe it's a coincidence let's try another couple numbers let's try some

negative numbers and a positive let's try a couple fractions bom bom bom and every single time I got the same result

but so they all land in the same place all land the same place and it was 618 and one point you know one 618

dividing once you make your line dividing from the beginning up towards a certain point where again when you first

divide you've got random results what are known as chaos and then you've got a smoothing up period and then you've got

a final constant 618 coming back from the end of that line towards the

beginning you've got a second constant of 1.618 and then you're walking over the

same territory that used to be your smoothing up period and then you walk over your random con sorry your random

chaos and then you're back at your starting point so it's the same thing up and down the line do you see any sort of

like parallel to this and like The Big Bang Theory and like just the the chaos of the universe and then here we are an

idilic Earth are we we could be like some like we are the final constant matically okay well yep you know uh

that's how does this manifest are we the manifestation say you know can't say for sure but I but I you know since you

brought up the big bang I think it's a good point U because if you can if you can conceptualize the Big Bang as being

the original um input of the numbers in your number line and of course when you

have a big bang you have stuff strewn everywhere so then you have chaos in your number line there is a you know

some uh collection of of uh of material that exploded so you can imagine your

number line being the same way a collection of stting numbers that explode into a series of other numbers

moving up the line okay and then U that that explosion turns into a you know a

random chaos and then turns into a final constant okay so someone put order to

the chaos exactly and all of our religious philosophies have always said this nobody ever said the Earth or the

universe or thing you know everything in between was created as is in one shot it's all about you know for example in

the in the Christian religion you know the on the first day God did this on the second day God did that blah blah blah

other religions you know it's it's the same thing so they always talk about the sort of like accumulation of of material

that that gets strewn about everywhere and along comes some you know Divine or

some some some Pres some power to smoo it out and put some order to it but isn't the tendency like

with thermodynamics and such a way like toward chaos as opposed to toward order

well if it's AR if it's AR if there's you know I think we kind of understand

the idea that you know um you have order uh but eventually you have chaos and if

you have chaos you eventually have order and I think that's sort of like the rule in the universe but you'd have you'd

have to ask yourself you know why is it that we have that order and why is it that we have that chaos so you know uh

if if this these are all so-called natural natural events why why would uh

nature in and of its own you know not being in an intelligence why would it

consider putting order to that chaos to begin with what what what what is nature there's nature like I'm getting tired of

all this being thrown around here I think I'm just going to put some order to it or nature says oh look at all this

order I'm getting tired of it I think I'm just going to give it a kick and see what happens so I think you know we're

we're ascribing you know uh uh you know uh uh potential powers to Nature that

haven't been proven to exist there's nothing in the socalled natural world

that can be proven to be natural all the material that we see um looks like it was created uh and

definitely in the solar system our solar system it was put into order and I think that's the next thing well we can't even

describe correctly anymore like really still to this day what is consciousness what is energy you know like if you take

the Aristotelian point of view even up to the turn of the century um most scientists would say the the universe

was eternal and it's funny because if you actually go back to the Bible it actually says something completely opposite it says in the in the beginning

um what what it said Genesis says there was a beginning so the ultimate cause of

the beginning was in terms of the Bible was God it actually says there was a creation moment that's a big and it's

literally describing science inside the Bible that's another issue had a wrong saying that's a very good point uh

Demitri very good point because um you know a lot of the you know I think we've

all seen it um as we investigate scientific topics we invariably run into

people uh who have those same interest but who think well that's just religion

this is science you know it's like like you know like like like somehow they're supposed to be separated which

they never were for a long time science and religion were were intertwined they were one and the same thing when people

spoke about science it was about they they they described the details of what

a God or Gods had created or or or was involved with there was never a

separation but well there was a branching off because you had you know Galileo and every because that that that

point there there was a difference between religion and science where they were like well wait a minute the sun is the center of the universe and it's like

well no it's not like obviously it's the Earth and that whole debate yeah that's right but no one ever said in the Bible

no one ever said that the sun was the center of the universe that's that's a that's a that's a human attachment to to

you know that that's that's a subjective Viewpoint so I don't really understand what I mean you know why well I'll just

interject because if you get into the Bible God actually tells us to do science because he says now I want you

to name the animals correct the naming of things is taxonomy it's literally the most basic applied science right correct

so he's like go I created the universe there's a big bang moment it's not Eternal done all the hard work I've done

all the hard work guys now go I'm going to rest now I'm going to rest now on the seventh day yeah and he also said get

you know get ye knowledge but more or something like get ye knowledge but more importantly get you understanding so

it's not just collecting the information but it's putting some kind of you know U uh you know Lo logical thought to it so

you're right uh religion and science were always intertwined but nowadays and and and at the time Jason when when you

know we were you know when we were living together you know the the whole UFO topic it was sort of like

anti-religion or anti-religious a lot of science uh communities uh thought that

religion was uh you know something that didn't indicate intelligence didn't indicate uh you know uh education didn't

educate or didn't indicate uh something as good as you know what what what what

what we're doing here so that was the first thing I I came across what I noticed was um the separation between

science and religion so as I was crunching the numbers I saw like like Demitri said that actually uh not just

the Bible but other religious tracks um are very consistent with what has been

shown to be U scient you know proven scientific results where they match so I

don't understand why there's this but anyway it's there I we have to knowledge it right so even nowadays uh if I say

I'm a religious person someone say you're a trump supporter yeah you know you say the underlying since you've

studied so much the underlying psychological and applied um knowledge

of all the religions more or less point up the same hierarchy and they would have different names and terms for it

but literally that's why they're all so parallel AB absolutely true yeah I don't think there's any difference between um

a religious philosophy that that's been around for a long time um

and the science that we have today in many cases the science is catching up to the religious philosophies which uh I

mean I I I guess we can I'm not sure if you want to keep going on this topic or not or you want to you want to change

gears a bit you let let me know what you I think that I mean I guess so first of all I just want to say like so you're

you have a new book coming out and it's very I've noticed as with your old book like guess a lot of this touches on sort

of religious themes to some extent um and that seems to be coming back in the UFO Community like there like I don't

know if you know um what is it Diana Pula like so she writes about she I think she's a religious studies like

Professor but she she actually went to the she got access to the Vatican Library which is like off limits to

everybody but she kind of got in there and they did this interesting part of her book where she goes in like some interesting you know I'm sure you would

have a field day in there um but uh she writes a lot about the combination

between religious and kind of looks a lot of the same kind of things I think that you're that you kind of look at I

mean it's it's you know very different but it's like it's you can sort of see the religious I think people are a

little more open-minded now in terms of how they're interpreting UFO like it's not all about like what you know the

mechanics of the propulsion system on the UFOs you're not trying to dissect it it's more like it's more almost

psychological and and spiritual which is it it's it's unfortunate because for somebody who like I you know all we have

is empirical data that's all we can kind of Base everything on like I'm as I'm a you know somewhat spiritual person

myself but it's like I can't like there's the scientific method exists for a reason and and it really like we have

to I think adhere to those those um rules if we want to actually prove

anything I mean it's just the part like you otherwise it's all speculation right like yeah well I would I would U yeah

I'm not sure Demetri do you want to weigh in on this okay no please I have something to ask but I want to hear yeah

okay so I agree with the sign you know that we should to a scientific process which religions do just as much as a

so-called quote unquote science Community does but um one of the one of the things I've noticed while crunching

the numbers and getting information on the on the planets and so forth DNA I found that um a lot of science people of

the opinion that science isn't about evidence um it's about predictions that that if we can predict

something's going to happen then we're closer to a truth than someone who can predict something but if any of us you

know does a casual check for failed scientific

predictions uh that could be its own book well then they just go that's science it's always autocorrecting

itself yeah the problem is people think that science is like a god so especially

when you have headlines yeah or scientism scientism yes yeah you know so you I'm just you know off topic but just

very quickly you'll have the you know the media will will will have quotes from someone who says this vaccine is is

a you know this covid vaccine is you know is safe it's effective you know

don't worry uh you know uh if if you don't want this that means you're some kind of a right-wing anti-scientific nut

or something like this and it comes down like a Ten Commandment Eternal stat but

there's a difference between like that's kind of like almost that's almost taking that's almost like religion take like

it's the analogous to like religion spirituality whereas this is not that's not science that's people it's people's

interpretation of what science is right so like I I think the scientific method and the kind of that approach of like

cold facts what can we prove yes let's look at things and I think like a lot of a lot of your books even the things that

aren't based on sort of numbers and things that you can actually have proofs about um it's still you can there's a

logic to it like there's a there's a like there it's not quite 100% science

like you're not it's not it's not you can't unequivocally prove something but you can look at something for example like look at pictures and I mean you had

the one picture what is it the the crucifixion from the 1300s where there's very clearly you see in this picture

what is it in Croatia or something or uh one of those countes kovo Kosovo yeah so but it's got this picture of the Sun and

what they say are sort of the sun and the moon but you can clearly see figures like with almost with gearshifts in it

from this painting from the 1300s up in up in this disc and it's like one looking back behind the other one yeah

like they're in an air like they're in an air fight like a dog fight and it's so it's no one comments on this except

to say that it's just religious symbolism um and then they show pictures of the sun um with a face and they say

it's the same kind of thing uh but if you look at those objects they're they're they're not you know the

particular ones you're talking about the ones in Caso um they're not U they can't

be the Sun for example one of them can't be the sun because it's it's dark

outside the stars are shining this is what you know the anybody who who has

read about this from the Christian Viewpoint knows that when when when Christ died on the cross that the sky was black and there was no sun so if for

someone to say that's just a symbolic representation of the sun it's like are we looking at the same picture here Budd

because you know it's clearly not so so it's not just the like you said it's a pictures but it's it's the way that the

the so-called science people they call themselves science people how they interpret it yeah it's clearly it's

clearly off Bas like but I can and I can understand how you would because it's like a question of finding the right

balance right because you can go too far and you can have people and you hear them they're interpreting everything as

like UFOs and this and that it's like no no no it's like you just have to apply like um this sort of objective logic and

look at something like that picture and be like okay this is the 1300s this is a picture of Christ dying on the cross you

know why are there stars in the sky and then this is supposed to be the sun why are why is the person's hands look like

he's on with a gear shift like why is it why would that be important it just takes away from the central theme which

is a crucifixion but at the same time when they made that picture and they saw those objects in the sky what looked

like gear shifts that would have been considered normal in the 1300s it would

it wouldn't have been you know otherwise it wouldn't have been in the picture right they don't want to detract from the main theme of the picture was a

crucifixion by putting a Ford and a Chrysler up in the sky or something right yeah so it's it's ridiculous to to

think that that those could be anything um other than natural objects I mean it's you know other than artificial

objects you you can't have a you know one person looking back and another person operating like you said a gear

shift what does that have to do with the central are you familiar with the anti-ra device who is it now anti I I

don't know how you say it in English correctly anti-ra device oh that's the one the for the for the ships well yeah

no one really knows what they were used they call it the world's first computer it's about 3400 BC and the gears inside

it were as we didn't have gears like that complex on Earth again until about the Swiss in the 1400s about 2,000 years

apart right it's incredible and so what were they using it for in the 3 to 400 BC range correct as a tool to navigate

and you know people have been around the world everyone knew the world was round that's just like sort of like a myth you

know set up that the world was flat you know like a lot the really intelligent Academia people knew but just um just to

divert on that so you do know about it um are you familiar with John Lennox the professor the mathematician who through

mathematics believes in God he's a British I believe mathematician no I don't know but you would love him he's

quite famous so what basically he would say this and he's he's very aligned with CS Lewis he's still alive um John Lennox

I think he's about 80 years old he's saying he's saying imagine right and Len

yeah talking about aren't we U it's funny but uh basically like men became

scientific because we expected law in nature and why did we expect law in nature because we believe in a lawgiver

yeah so because we believe in a God and there's laws we expect that when we look into the nature we will also find laws

not just physical laws but moral laws as well very good point yeah it's it can be very abstract and in that sense we

actually are inheriting science from the judeo Christian Traditions absolutely

cuz this is where now like there's a lawgiver here are the laws go forth check into nature you will find the

underlying principles there still hence back all you must name everything and give it a name and start measuring like

I don't see I I if we could solve one thing in our lifetime to bridge the gap between science and religion yep I agree

and that's the theme of the book I'm right the too too often there's this conflict between them um to detract from

the you know the main issue for for the average person you know working a job taking care of a family or you know

going about their business in life they might not have time to go and and and do all all the all these kinds of checks

right so you know what's the one thing that you could Point them to so that

they can look at that you know take five minutes from their life and take a look at that and say you know what there's something going on here so for me and

the way the approach I it was the numbers not the pictures because the pictures are important but photos can be

you know photoshopped right manipulated but the numbers can't the numbers are raw material and that's my Approach that

I used uh because I wanted to put it in in as simple a way as possible so that

the average person could see this by just looking for five minutes or maybe 10 minutes and then if they have got

more time they can check more of themselves later so rather than just pushing their face into it I kind of you

know or or using some appeal to Authority oh my God you know we see too much of this you know I'm Professor so

and so from this so you know because of because of where I work uh what I'm saying is true and it's like you know

nothing could be further from the truth um so I like you know I'm hoping that if

anything can be gained by all of this it's that the average person gets their

their interest peaked and they've got the time to go and do some checks themselves and don't take any of our

words for anything take a look yourself and you know and go from there just in a pop culture reference like 25 years ago

I didn't really understand it I just thought it was a cool movie but in The Matrix you know they're staring the movie The Matrix and just thring at all

the numbers going across the screen zeros and ones and you're like okay computers Matrix all that kind of stuff

but then the guy who lived in this you know future time he's like you just see zeros and ones across the screen I see a

lady in a red dress yeah it's almost like the mathematics behind the color the shape and everything so he's seeing

the numbers behind the material that we interact with everyday life right so to

your point once you actually see that there's mathematics all around us and it it actually has a constant like you said

and it's so um do you what do you do you like the whole fine tuning of the universe do you ever get into that sort

of concept as well like things are just so precisely fine-tuned that it just couldn't be random um I think it's yeah

uh the moon has to be a certain distance from the earth a certain side to make an eclipse yeah but again yep you know he's

right it could there that could be part of the order um you know could and is is

two different things right but you know it could be but I I have I have a hard time believe I think the you know like

an average person would have a hard time believing that if you were to look at

the nine planets in our solar system and the moon and you compared each one of

those objects to each of the other objects and found out that they were related in exactly the same

way and then you checked human DNA the length and width of our DNA molecules

and our number system and found that they were related in exactly the same

way that those planets are and then the whole thing becomes related that's where I say it's not random anymore okay

because you haven't said it explicitly and I want to make sure that our listeners understand this because I I know because I've read the book this

point being this this um sequence of any any two numbers eventually coales to 618

and that number is 618 too and and 1.618 yeah um and that number is found for

example with DNA the length and the width like okay hang on yeah let's yeah

so uh 618 and 1.618 is found in in the lot of the the

physical world um and it's a general rule for figur figuring out distances within a

pentagon you know a a five-sided Pig figure called The Pentagon so that's

generally how the 1.618 and 618 relates to um you know the abstract world would

be the the the mathematical uh design you know the five-sided figure of a pentagon well the rules are there for

determining the the the you know distances within a pentagon you use 618 and 1.6 now in the that's fascinating

well it's true that is just fascinating so but I'm Str so because I'm me like

I'm uh no give yourself more credit okay so not an absolute okay well you haven't met my

wife or what she has to say or you probably have a different opinion of herself okay yeah yeah okay so so here

here's the thing so U the the pentagon shape it sounds like a okay so that's know no big deal could be a circle could

be a square what the hell is the difference with you know who cares if it's if it you know the 618 1.6 relate

to a pentagon well the issue becomes um the shape of the universe itself so the

shape of the Universe um you know the universe is expanding you know we know that from the

red light shift right uh but but the universe is expanding in a set Manor and

the set Manor is something called I mentioned here doic cedrin which is

basically a bunch of pentagons stuck together like a soccer ball so if you can imagine a soccer ball and you uh you

know you have a soccer ball and then you put your your air pump in the in the in the hole of the soccer ball and you

start pumping air into it and then you know the soccer ball gets bigger and bigger and bigger but those little pentagons that make up the soccer ball

are still intact just getting stretched and the relationship remains and relationship Remains the Same so the

universe is you know is expanding in the shape of a pentagon and just by coincidence our number system relates to

two constants that are found in pentagons this is like how sorry like but how do they what do you mean it's

expanding in the shape of a pentagon like how are they okay so imagine that you're um that you're on a soccer ball

you're standing on a soc no I understand but like how okay cuz I just see like a blue sky right so like I like how how

are how are you know whomever is determining this okay so you know we can see the Blue Sky because it's our

atmosphere right but if we if we were we if our eyes were good enough and we could see you know past the atmosphere

and through our solar system and through all the galaxies that we have you know that we have knowledge of keep going MH

somewhere in that space there's more space it's constantly expanding and it's

expanding in the direction in all directions mhm um in the shape of a pentagon so the expansion is happening

in a five-sided sequence but how are they inferring that like is it are they looking at like radio waves or know I

mean so yeah that's right they're looking I they I mean um no one knows sure why it's happening in that manner

but enough people now have taken a look at this that they say okay there's some

there's some kind of order to this so the universe is expanding in a set order just like it's held together in a set

order can you tell me why it is expanding no name is Chris not God I

can't tell you that yeah but I but I can I I can tell you that um that would be

quite a bombshell if he dropped I almost wonder if it's just like a met my special guest today God

the Father I just wonder if it's a metaphor sometimes that like knowledge is infinite and therefore we can never

actually reach the end of knowledge right yeah maybe but like and is it Fool's goal to even try to race for that

because like literally like maybe the con that we should all appreciate is here on Earth and perhaps there's

another planet in a goldilock zone or perhaps mathematically there just isn't this is all there is and it's such a

precious mathematical constant so so like I don't know there's so much information here I don't like it's so

like I'm just trying to I'm just trying to narrow down because I just want to make sure like can I try it can I TR I'm

just saying like the the expansion like I get the expansion because it's like doler shift and everything like that but so they know it's expanding but I just

don't understand how they how it's expand in the shape of a pentagon I I just can't visual circle like you know

like a bunch of pentagons as they stretch they you know when you you have it looks the earth looks flat at the

moment it's actually round so the same idea uh okay so now I'm so if they're

for example taking some satellite array and they're kind of like you obviously simplifying it God knows what they use

but like they're sort of pointing it and they're like okay so it's red shifting this far out and this patch of face and

then they kind of narrow down like oh that's a radio Wes okay okay all right okay that makesense

microwave kind of yeah that's right so the visual and and the you know the the what you can see what you can't see yeah

so they put them together now again uh this is a guess right they're guessing

but what I find interesting about this guess is isn't it interesting that

they're claiming that the universe is expand expanding in the form of a pentagon but no one is making the Rel

you know commenting on the relationship between that pentagon shape and those

numbers in our number system that relate to the same thing so if you're a scientist and you can see the symbolism

of our numbers matching you know the the the constants in our numbers which are you know 6181 618 um those are two of

the constants um and and you see the physical world and you see a relationship and you're silent about it

how can you be a scientist and that and that's what I found so I really started to dig after that cuz I'm like well how

come nobody's talking about this so then I started to check more closely and that's when I found the whole relationship between our number system

DNA and the planets and there's actually four numbers 618 and 1.618 I don't you

want to you want to kind of like get the topic going here but 618 going up the line 1.618 going down the line and also

when you're going up and down on that line You'll usually find

617 and 1 . 619 and those are the dimensions of DNA

the length and width of our DNA molecule 34

angstroms 21 angstroms divide them you get 1.61 n

1way and 617 so the shape the length and width of

our DNA is related to those two numbers just before you get the two number constant so you always get 617 or 1 619

before you hit the constants of 618 or 1. so it's like a like a drum roll get

ready folks here it comes and that's your 617 and 1. 619 and then

Tada then you get your constant of 618 or 1.618 so that's basically that rule

that Demitri was talking about like that order this is the law and this is you know this is how it's done that's the

order that we're talking about it's very obvious I mean I'm no Einstein I just I

just took the same numbers that everybody else I like you know anybody can open a book and get the numbers do the same thing so it's just a question

of you know uh a lot of people don't have time for this a lot of people read headlines um a lot of people are afraid

if if they see that relationship to this this these constants they you know in

this extraterrestrial you know presence they're afraid of being you know maybe painted as religious Chris can I ask you

one like more like like philosophical question so this is this like you said I'm following you yeah you're so

knowledgeable on this but there's got to be other people in the world understand this too right so why why what is what

is the veil that is preventing Humanity from wanting to share this information okay so my opinion on this I can't say

for sure I have an opinion because there's no numbers I can use to figure that out but my opinion is there's too many careers at stake that that the last

thing you know if let's say you know if tomorrow morning we wake up

and and uh you know the headline says U we have found extraterrestrial Intelligence on on MAR on the moon or

something okay so a lot of people would be out of work unfor people who are looking for

for example SEI seti you know or or something like that people who are who are supposed to be in the business of

looking for this they would be out of a job the stock markets would crash so you think it's the SE the SE Lobby that's

keeping people well I'm just saying it's a whole employment thing lot of lot of

people who teach that there is no uh that there is no extra trust your intelligence or that there is no God

that it's just you know the The Atheist there's enough people that would lose their job and then the politicians

would have to comment on it the politicians would have to say something and the last thing they want to do is you know actually be truthful to people

for is this is this what I would maybe call sorry Jason but is this what I would call like the banality of evil

like it it actually is evil but there's no actual like wizard behind the curtain like has just got their own personal

vested interests and they mean to do good because they want to feed their family and pay their mortgage and

through this sort of having to satisfy the material demands of living we

therefore cut ourselves off from actually getting to the truth I think that's a that's a pretty

valid point except I would say I think it's deliberate okay not I don't I you said a lot of people get into it because

you're looking for the truth um I'm not sure if that's I'd like to think it's true well there could be like those who

don't mean to do evil but are like perpetuating it and those who truly like the few who truly know the game what

they're trying to hide so so to your question do you believe in evil yes okay

I just wanted to like see I believe in in a in a wouldn't be inate discourse without a you're like a question on Good

and Evil I guess just just because math and it's it's scientific

and it's something it's the clarity of like our thought and understanding the universe and something is preventing us

from sharing this knowledge across the world and helping Society Elevate to where we're supposed to be so I don't

know what else I would call that I think I I think I understand his point is that um it's the evil that's pre preventing

us from putting uh order to our knowledge okay I think maybe that's what he means to get up but and you know um

I'm not sure like I can't be sure 100% um

if it if you know if if this evil I let's face it if there's if there's a supreme evil quote unquote then there're

I guess by definition it would be a supreme good and then why would the Supreme good allow the Supreme evil to

do these things right so I'm not sure of that of that Pro you know I think everybody you know maybe has an opinion

on this uh but I would suggest to everyone just take take a look crunch

the numbers yourself don't believe what you hear today or you read tomorrow uh

find out for yourself and then go back um and listen to what you you've heard

and you know reread what you read put it together yourself um anyone can tell you

something right that's that that's the thing but whether or not it's actually true I think each person has to do the work themselves so I'm yeah hoping I can

introduce people get them interested enough in the topic that they can do that so one of the things in your last

book um was aside from the numbers was also showing the uh similar ities

between kind of global stories yeah that's true I I think especially with the um you know the so-called Christ

figure in history I think there's a lot of u a lot of uh interesting evidence to

support the idea that U this figure was not uh um isolated to one area in the

Middle East I think there have been a number of these Christlike figures um

throughout history in various parts of the World whether it's the same person many times or the same kind of person

many times we're not sure but in any case um you know I I I think there's a

there's a reason why uh people who didn't know each other who lived in various parts of the world had no idea

that those other parts of the world even existed or that there were other people in those other parts of the world they

all magically came up with the same kind of story of a of a of a hero of some

sort born of a Virgin uh mother uh hunted by the authorities uh performed

great acts of kindness and and and and and specific Miracles uh physical

Miracles uh and then was killed by the state came back uh you know resurrected

came back um and then uh left a a final message uh before departing so I I kind

of can't imagine that the that kind of consistency could be found in in stories

throughout the world different languages different cultures different times over over thousands of years uh um and all

linking people who never knew each other so I I just think that that that would be absurd to think that that could

actually and you also actually surprised because I I read this a long time ago and I I reread it in preparation for this interview but it was like I'm

surprised at how much uh you know quotes and historical material you have in the

book where you're linking for example things like ponus pilot said or various Roman Senators public information right

you yeah which which corroborates the this idea you know they talking about Christ as if it's he you know he was a

real person he's like yeah that guy who's like out there like causing the Ruckus or whatever like you'll see that

in various quotes So this idea of having that that he's a was a real person then kind of going back with I you know um in

terms of some of the other religions like uh Krishna for example you reference well the yeah I specifically mentioned the Muslim uh you know Islam

as well because you know they they of Islam and Christianity they're you know

two prophetic religions right they've got they've got some of prophets some someone that was considered to be uh you

know having Divine guidance from from from some God uh you know preaching to

people some you know Islam has them Christianity has them you know they've got the same ones in many cases um and

and they they agree on the fact that that this what what the Christians call

uh Jesus Christ was an actual physical person born of a virgin mother Islam

believes this very well uh Christ performed Miracles Islam concurs with

this believe it just like the Christians do you know the the major one of the major differences between the two is that they don't believe that Jesus

actually died Islam believes that he was resurrected in whole in body without actually dying and that someone who

looked like him died on the cross but you know it doesn't take away from the

fact that they're both referencing uh what they consider to be a historical figure so I you know I I look at that

and say these two religions often don't agree but they're agreeing on this so I'm going to take a closer look at it

because that's probably what they're not agreeing on is probably closer to a truth and what maybe what what they're

not agreeing on so that that was kind of like my my modus operandi when I when I did this yeah right and so and um

another thing you know I don't know if it was in this book or you had a real thing with like languages correct so so

maybe if you want to talk a little bit about that like this book was called Hollow be the name and it occurred to me

you know I I'd forgotten why that book had that name and it wasn't just kind of like Che play on words yeah but it was I

think am I right in believing that the Moon that am I right in believing that

Hollow is means or that the moon referring to the Moon either the Moon is

hollow or there's great parts of it that are Hollow um and and you know that that

that's that's the belief based on the fact um that a lot of our

languages uh when they reference U the moon the sounds that the actual phonetic

sounds that they use um are are pretty close to the same kind of phonetic

sounds that they would use for for hollow or empty for I'll give you Korean

just very quickly for for the for the listeners you know a tongue Tong bin in Korean means hollow tongol

refers to the Moon in Icelandic uh languages so here are people that don't know each other and

it's a connection of sounds that are that are matching so there's a lot of this in our languages of course I also

mentioned in the first book most of the languages that the world U has seen are

gone so this is another issue right there's thousands of extinct languages

um so you know we might not ever get to the bottom of that but I just thought it was interesting that some of these

sounds for the word moon are matching sounds for the word Hollow so I started

to take a closer look at that and as you saw you know there's a couple of people who researched this you know scientists

and they thought that they found the same thing um there it's it's not clear whether

that you know whe whether the moon itself is hollow could be could not or there's great parts that Hollow or that

there's something hidden in there in one of the hollows like you know in the bottom of a crater or something so

there's a lot of references to um going inside the

moon um you know and the and the names that they use for the moon itself so the

idea of hollow or going into an empty space and the moon are which is unusual because the moon was considered for by

many people to be a god um and the last thing that they ever would have thought of was that this was Hollow God but but

it's interesting because it's like I guess the idea is that we we almost have Echoes of ancient long dead languages

that are kind of propagating this idea of a you know maybe there was some

knowledge there that the moon was Hollow right how would yeah and that's we just get Echoes of that now that we're inter

yeah I just you know I mean if if you can can imagine like you know we were

construct you know we we constructed a language so um if if I saw some uh you

know if I saw a woman with red hair so you know I would think of a name for her

I probably reference the word red you know if she if she was a short red-haired woman I you know if if I had

to use a language to describe her I would probably describe something about her being a woman and her being short

and her having red hair I wouldn't say she was a big tall um um you know uh

muscle rat or something gym rat or something like this so you know why would the why would the the idea of

these you know why why would they they concur so closely well I know this about like like a ancient more older languages

English is one we're speaking and it's newer and I think we've lost this or we've become removed from it but when

you look at something like Greek which is the only other language I kind of know uh a word like fire and a word like

light have the same root word in English we don't have it they sound completely separate Concepts and that's totally

logical right we would think that right you build the you build the vocabulary around the concept s of thing around the

physical aspect exactly so you might have like luminescence light and then we have fire which is just completely on

the opposite it doesn't sound the same nothing about it but so a lot of times I was able to guess what the word was in

Greek by looking for the root word root and thinking of the context going I think they're talking about this yeah so

I could actually just kind of logically extrapolate from the root word out and find the knowledge right and imagine

imagine if you visited people you know this is from the from the Greek language imagine if you went um halfway across

the world let's say somewhere in Mexico or something and you talk with those people and they had the same root sound

for their light or their fire they kind of do there's tribes in Peru that have about

250 words that are exactly sounding like Words then you would say you know then

you make a connection say this is this is interesting right but it's it's not done here we we don't have that kind of

science that Jason was referring to like the process where you see something interesting and then you know you kind

of put it to the test and you know you you kind of try to build on that but W

with always with the idea that you know every piece of this step has to fit if

there's one piece off it's not any good so I I think that you but just a precursory look at least to start but we

don't get that uh and that that's one of the problems with with our ability to gain knowledge and to gain perspective

is that we don't seem to you know for most people they don't have the time right and and for a lot of the people who do have the time uh they're not

telling us the truth can I ask you a question cuz I one of my courses in University was like the psychological analysis of the Bible and one of the

things they were saying was that to study you have to really try to look back at the the way it was originally written either in Greek Aramaic or or

Hebrew depending on what you're trying to read so something like when you say eating from the Apple uh the app but we

say apple but in like Greek it'd be like fruit and we been like oh we'll call it Apple but fruit and then you can

actually go further back and say fruit of your loin so like the original sin was like they were actually cannibalism

like they can actually get deeper into the way the words are constructed right fruit of the Loy could be referring to a

sexual connotation so maybe it was the idea of Adam and Eve having sex that got

kind of like bite into the Apple maybe they if if it's fruit of the loin then maybe they're referring to sexual or but

certainly not as simple as like the word oh Apple you know what I mean it just become so removed from the deeper

context yeah it would make sense that people who who maybe didn't have clothes to start uh threw those clothes on

quickly after they partook of their individual fruits of the loin and then

decided that we better throw some clothes on before God catches on so you know a little

perverts but but you know I think I think the point Demitri's point is that um is there there's other sounds that

are linked as well not just the ones I'm referenced in the book here but there are other sounds around the world that are that are linking up and this should

be uh a point to start an investigation why are these languages Linked UP And

what what is it so we don't get a lot of that you think it was maybe like 200 300

years ago the only thing to link cultures together would be secondary tertiary evidence like cultural norms

that are similar or languages but now we've gone into the more what uh you know 23 and me let's check if these

cultures are genetically and we just sort of let that kind of die by the wayside a bit Yeah I think there was a

little bit of that going on 200 years ago to be fair like oh you dance the same dances or you have the Greek key on

these same aztech uh pyramids as they had on the Roman times how did you draw this exact symbol the same and now we're

just like well let's just check DNA yeah but you know yeah yeah this is It's a valid point he there's other connections

other than just biological ones living in a time now where things be in that type of science yeah and I think that

there's and for sure it can't be discounted like this this whole thing with the hollow and the moon it's like

you know the reason people aren't talking about it is because they can infer the mass of the Moon based on the gravity right so like I I'm sure so the

notion that it's Hollow seems to ring a little Hollow you know what I mean like but but I I understand what you're

saying about the the language but like and and it's interesting so who knows maybe it's a maybe it's a space station

right it's like the Death Star open they shoot rockets at one point time and it rang like a bell have I not heard that

story somewhere actually yeah actually you know the the um if you know the the

math that we've been shown is that there's something called you know the physics it's called the moment of

inertia which basically means if an object's Hollow it's going to have a certain mathematical relationship and

it's not there they say it's not there but in in all fairness they haven't checked to see if there are any they've

only they've only scoured the surface so it's hard to figure out um just just from that alone but you're right um you

know the the general understanding in science nowadays is that U you know the

the DNA aspect uh is the most important part uh but again that's one you know

you you can't take a p you you you couldn't look at the picture of of a Mona Lisa and then cut out one piece of

it and say that represents the whole picture because there's other parts and that's the part that's missing in our

science they're not working together to give us the picture they're working in individual pieces for their own

individual purposes and I think that's one of the reasons why you mentioned Jason pulling the veil back on this

information is really hard to do can you imagine if people who for years said the

Moon is a naturally formed object that that Coes from a bunch of gas and and

particles at a naturally occurring Big Bang only to find out that this moon is

actually like a uh has either been an artificial construction or had some kind

of artificial Construction done to it after it was made this would like you know it would be totally what would

people say I want my money back because you you you paid to you know I paid you to lie to me right well I could I would

make the argument though that enterprising young physicists could be like that's how they would make their name as disproving a a long held thing

and isn't that a battle between those two they're not getting a government grant you know they're they're they're more like let's figure out a way to

colonize the moon but if we talk about about whether the moon's a natural object or not good luck trying to go to

the government to get a grant this is It's All About grants this is know one of the issues right yeah so they're not

going to find a job in the in the Private Industry so they got to get a government grant and if the government says that those are natural objects

they're going to say I'll take the money and I'll and I'll show you that it's a natural object that's it how how can you speak out against covid you said what

happened to all the doctors think the Moon is this some some have tried that some have tried to speak

out again some medical people have tried to speak out we all saw what you know it never made the mainstream news but like

you mentioned the social media it's pretty clear that there's a lot of people who are who are against it you

know against this whole idea of of forcing a vaccination on a population right so I think yeah that that's that

that you mentioned the scientific process uh that's you know the fact that we're we're not following those steps is

one issue but I think and you mentioned you think it's it's the evil part that's taken over I'm not sure how to how to

describe but the but but the end result is this we're not getting the information all

the information that we should be privy to and we're not getting the right

people putting it together so that's where I you know I'm hoping that individuals can do this on their own

step by step like a hobby yeah do your own research right like do your own research start with the numbers yeah ask

questions look around U you know and find out for yourself because I think this is what was the original uh

intention I can't believe that it's all linked up every single planet nine planets the moon DNA our number system

all linked the same way to the shape of the universe that's expanding the same

618 one that really like you know you couldn't roll the dice and never get and never get you know that kind of a random

occurrence so that alone should be enough to to open some people's eyes yeah do how much of this do you think is

suppression from the uh so-called military-industrial complex because you

know there's like I mean big black budgets right like this like there's a whole I forget how much it is ridiculous

like a third of the American budget is like goes to that's not an accurate figure Daniel

inway yeah the former you know the the late Congressman Daniel inway Democrat from Hawaii he made the point he said

there's a government within the government and a military within the military um and an

industrial um system within the the public indust you know there's a private one within the public one and he said

that's those are the people calling the shots other people said that you know Cent but for Congressman to come out and

say I mean it never got the light of day you know rarely do the media report on

this at all yeah what do you think of the recent Congressional hearings with uh D what is it David gr Gres and um the

you know the intelligence operative who came out and said like yeah they do have um it was very high level he had access

he did worked on I think the daily president brief and stuff like that so like somebody like that coming out and

giving a presentation to Congress along with David FR and um I know the I forgot

the other guys's name but but all who have you know gone on record with pretty big claims the disclosure Project's been

around for a long time long before those Congressional hearings I don't know if you guys have heard of it before yeah yeah so they they've talked about a lot

of this stuff too but again it's opinion it's you know it wasn't under uh you know any kind of scrutiny but um I don't

think anybody doubts that that there's some sort of extra testal intelligence

that exists I really don't think anybody doubts that now um and I think governments realize that I think maybe

maybe 50 years ago there were doubters I think now most people think uh that there's some kind of extraterrestrial

intelligence you know UFOs SL alien slash you know uh whatever would you say

they're from Earth or from outside of Earth what do the what does the research can't determine that a lot of

the interesting theories kind of coming out these days are that maybe it's not extraterrestrial intelligence it's actually just something on Earth that

maybe there's some sort of link between dimensions and uh all kinds of like

craziness yeah yeah I agree that that's the other part of this that's changed right people always assumed it was from

something outside outside the Earth coming in but now others are thinking it could be something within within this

area that that that these kinds of people have been here for a while and they're just you know observing and

preparing and you know waiting for this final moment of course completely consistent with religious philosophies

i' say that there's going to be a you know a final Reckoning um and it's going to happen suddenly uh and that there is

going to be an evil presence that's going to pretend to be a good presence you know it's all pretty consistent um

you know as far as you know the prediction factor is uh but but as far as um you know I'm limited to what I can

with the numbers uh and you know and and and the biology and the phys i i i i

limit myself to that um and I also live myself to Common Sense something I can prove so if I say something to you guys

I got to be able to show it I just can't say it so I got to be able to you know prove it in some way so I so there's a

lot of conjecture a lot of stuff going on yeah it could be but you know let's establish first that there is some sort

of EXT there may be more than one there may be more than one competing there may be a grand one with minor on we know

we're not we're not sure right but just the whole idea I think most people understand that there's aliens or UFOs

or something like this but let's get some particulars into how we know this other than um you know my my I think or

here's a picture or I think I think the math part of it is a good way for for a neutral Observer somebody who maybe

doesn't have an opinion one way or the other on this you know how would you get them started what's your first step so

first step is take them down the road easy here's some you know pick any two numbers you want here's a format see

what you can find now look at the physical world around you and see what you can see there yeah and I I think

that's kind of like what I'm can I just try this sentence on you I want to see how how you would interpret it if you

want to get away from the fine-tuning argument it's so improbable you need a mechanism to increase the probabilities

you need to consider a Multiverse but these universes are not accessible to us and there's no evidence to support their

existence does that resonate in any way with you like the fine tuning is just so

exact that we have to then accept some sort of higher intelligence built this

if we don't accept that then we have to get into multiverses but but multiverses are not

going to be accessible to us and we can't really prove their existence so that brings us back to the fine-tuning

but the argument against that would be the anthropic principle and it would say that we are we observe the perfectness

of our universe because only in a perfect Universe could we observe that it's perfect okay that's deep well but

but it but true it's I mean like maybe there would be a trillion different ways

that we could have manifested and certainly a lot more than that that we could have manifested in this exact perfect universe but all the other

trillion ones we wouldn't be around to speculate on it only only in the perfect Universe would we be able to speculate

on it sound right to you Chris and I think yeah I I agree with you guys and I think there's a lot of of um uh uh

possibilities for why this universe is quote unquote perfect U you know for

example the speed of light is fixed uh the speed of sound in our atmosphere is fixed uh uh and other other uh constants

uh in in physics you know uh Force equals mass s acceleration blah blah blah right so you know we've got all

that and that's I think the fine tuning part but the issue is what you know becomes um is that a natural occurrence

or is that an artificial occurrence so then you would look past the fixed Parts the fine tomb

parts and you would look at order within chaos and I think that's probably the

first clue that there something going on if you can look at the order with if you can see the chaos and you can see the

order within the chaos I think people you know for example I'm just going to

give you a quick R because you know I know you guys time but imagine we we were walking in a

forest okay you know we're taking a trip in the forest there not necessarily looking for Eaves apple or anything like

this just going off for just going over for a CHP in the forest we're going for a walk and you know we got we've got um

uh maple trees on one side of us and oak trees on the other side of us okay and

we're walking along the path whatever and we come to a log cabin in the middle of the woods and people we look at w

this beautiful Log Cabin it's you know very solid looks great you know and we find out it's made from Oak and maple

you know like okay so you you would say well I think somebody may I think somebody put that together I I don't

think that could have happened by itself but the equivalent scientific argument

would be well uh the natural occurrence of the wind and the Sun and the rain and

uh climate change and uh maybe Trump and a few other things all got together and

vo that's how you know that this cabin occurred because we don't see these people who made this cabin so therefore

we have no proof that you know that this cabin exists so the the absence of proof

it's nobody's saying but I mean that's a big difference I mean nobody's saying that well because people aren't saying

that there's no way that like solar system is a law cabin you know what they say solar system is a law cabin I've

heard it said like this before and the superhero in this moment is always given enough time this will naturally occur

and they throw it like a superhero just just throw more time at it we're talking about billions of years don't worry about it I'm like I got to agree 110%

here like they they make up the rules as they go along if they if they have a theory that they consider to be a fact

and then some some evidence conflicts with it they just stretch the theory to accommodate the new oh my god there so

much of that string theory I mean that's been around for 40 years and like it's kind of like they just keep tweaking it

and tweaking it's like so crazy now it's still a theory yeah yeah but you know you but but that being said I I still

think I mean like the Log Cabin analogy I'm not sure works because people are most people are saying okay the big bang

I agree it's it's it's as inexplicable as a Creator you know like they're both equally on the same level as far as I

can tell but nobody's saying that like the for example the solar system it's a CO it's a a CO a coalesence of like um

of gravity like that you know what I mean like the the sun is drawing things to it that all Mak sense that's okay

yeah it all yeah I agree but the order the the way in the way the sizes of

those objects how they rotate and how far they are from the Sun you know their

orbital period has nothing to do with a natural occurring event they could you

know those are first of all um you know those objects if they were created uh at

the same time as the sun um there's a good chance that they would be part of the sun now right the sun's 99% of the

mass right so we're talking about 1% of the solar system having an order and

a fine-tuning that that matches the human DNA and the human

number system that never existed before those planets did so the so solar system

showed up in a certain order to it and just by coincidence life occurred on the earth

after that solar system was formed and that life matches the order of the of

all the planets around it again I'll hit you with the anthropic principle though like because we wouldn't I mean be

around to observe it if if we weren't if things didn't kind of work out like I the ratio is the I guess the the big

argument here is like Sy right yeah yeah there were there were there were no numbers there there were no people to

conceive of numbers when the solar system was formed so the fact that people conceived of those num first of

all well tree falls in the forest does anyone hear it right like the number system the the the concept of number matches but it m the thing is is that it

matches how can the number how can our number system match um you know postmatch the

existence of the the solar system came first human life came second DNA came

second and then the number system came third and they're all that's not to do ENT number numbers existed as a concept

when whether there's people here no no they didn't they didn't exist until people there was one there was one

molecule or two molecules let me give you okay so does a deer have a number system or or a skunk or a rabbit do they

have a number system they may not have a system to describe it but the the exist

they don't have that concept that's that's one of the other reasons why we were created and we didn't evolve from an ape which is a topic for another day

but we'll we'll talk we there the entry principle has to do with with energy conserving energy and putting energy and

taking energy out but it has nothing to do with abstract thought so when abstract thought abstract thought never

showed up on this Earth until told people that before that there was no abstract thoughts or Consciousness right

but I think I don't know that's kind of split Hawkins Hawkins said you know

because there is a because there is a law such as gravity that the Universe can create itself from nothing but this

doesn't really make much sense because it's self-contradictory because he's saying because there is something

Gravity the universe can create itself from nothing so it makes no sense

it's yeah it's like saying if I say x created y you know that sort of thing but what he's really saying is because

like X created X and nothing can't make something from nothing that's nonsense well here's okay here's so so I don't

ever understood this argument go ahead Jason yeah no I I I I agree with that I think that that that self-referential

thing doesn't work like I and I have problems with a big bang too it's or I have problems in so much the way I look

at it is like look there's limits to what what humans know right like so that they're can say there's no proof their

contention is there's no proof for a Creator so they have this thing called the big gang and I or big gang Big Bang

okay but how how youl okay how would you explain not just the not just the order I mean you know there's order in the

like you said planets revolve around the Sun so you know there there's some kind of order there but how are their sizes

related to their motions so for example the size of mercury Rel you know just

pick a planet random the size of mercury for example related to the to the rotation period of

Pluto we're talking about a physical you know the the the the size of a physical

object and it's and its movements they're not related well they're related to their rotation around the Sun okay

okay but and whatever else size related to size but size related to movement

that's not that's not a natural occurrence right across the board the size and the motion and the movement you

know the rotation period movement the orbital period movement and the sizes movement you know physical physical

movement movement all related together in the same manner as we see in our own

DNA and our own number system an abstract number system I find that hard

to understand as a natural process I understand the order but it's the same order it's the same order as our number

system the same order as our DNA in the same order in the solar system how are they all matching is that is that some

kind of like you know Universal rule like light travels you know 186282 miles

a second is that like some rule that all life has to follow you know 34 angstroms

length and 21 angstroms width yeah as all number systems have to F so I I kind

of think that that the human understanding of numbers is something

that was directed that didn't happen by chance because I have a hard time believing that number systems that are

abstract thoughts could match physical objects that pre-existed them by thousands of years or millions of years

so it just happened to be like that it just happens to be that that what we conceived of happens to be in the

broader picture the order of the solar system and the Order of something that for the first people who made those

numbers they never saw human DNA they had no idea what that was what is you know more and more I I really think uh

we're in a simulation like more and more I think that we are in some sort of projection call it whatever you want

Oran theater and I it's almost I don't know like a video

game somebody's playing yeah like a lot of people have this op I agree with you a lot of people think my son's one of

them my son thinks that that this is like a hologram kind of you you know the

reality is kind of like a projected hologram but is this really any different from what things like the Bible says just we're using more modern

terminology this world isn't real it's the world that's outside of this world that yeah y you know if you analyze it's

like literally telling us we're telling you what's happening like this ain't real you have no power over me here this

blah blah blah right it's literally saying what you see is a mirage right are we just using modern verbage to

describe it if we spoke Hebrew you know like whatever Aramaic or whatever the Bible was sort of originally written in

like the words for all we know could just be like yeah no literally this is a simulation we're we're telling you

what's happening you're the rules of the game and everybody over the Generations we've just kind of abstracted that and

every generation is going to use the words they understand best So today we're going to use words simulation computer things like that and back in

the day they're going to use the words they understood correctly to describe it the best they could really you know um

that just makes I saw I I don't know why again it's the whole religion versus science debate and I think they actually completely align so you know the best

science the best science you know the the science we have today so-called I call it

science because it's very tricky and it's very uh sort of scheming it's not

science per se it's more like science so I I you know I have the my my view here is that that it's a pretty arrogant

attitude to have to build on other people's you know legitimate science work and then turn around and trash that

and say this is this is what I'll give you a classic example here um we're talking about um whether there is a a

God that exists and and you know how life occurred here and a lot of people the opinion the you know it's a natural

event that life uh started here from a from a a random mixture of chemicals and

and other temperatures and locations and series of events and created the first

cells and then from there light life expanded right um Francesco ready uh is

probably not a name a lot of people here have have seen in in a school textbook he did the you know the F he he he did

one of the first experiments uh to show that there's no there's no way that

nature could produce life that that the only way life occurs on Earth is from

other life and then another guy followed him uh and his name was uh there's ready

and then there's um uh uh pasture Louis pasture uh same thing he came up with

this idea uh that you can't have life from non-life he did experiments

everybody has seen these experiments nobody questions them tindo was a physicist same thing he did his

experiments came up the third time and then in the middle of all that guess who showed up with the natural occurrence of

mankind Charles Darwin well you know and he's revered by the science Community

today and that guy absolutely ignored the scientific results that his

predecessors found and today it's the same thing they're still looking for how life started and there have already been

science experiments that have shown that the only way life can start is from another life um impacting it or

kickstarting it or getting started but doesn't Evolution just I mean it's it's not that it's looking for when life

started it's it's explaining how life evolved okay well mankind they say

started from an evolution from a great ape a great ape that they haven't proved

they have no physical evidence of they have no reason to to believe that this animal existed except that it fits their

Theory uh and and they base this first of well Daren based on on how it looks

apes look like people people look like apes so they must have the same common ancestor I mean it's it's ridiculous if

you look in in nature um you know you can uh I think most of have seen a cow

and most of have seen a whale and most of us would say they're not related but they're actually from the same family

and they don't even look like each other then you've got a rabbit and a hair which are they they look pretty close

and they are from the same family but they can't mate and they couldn't produce so you know the look The

lookalike theory has nothing to you know and then but but you know this is what

Darwin used and then later lo and behold we've got our our science which is much

better than the religions remember and they said no no no no mankind wasn't created we came we evolved from an ape

an ape that had 48 chromosomes and fused two of them together to make 46 CH or 47

or 46 eventually got mankind what do those chromosomes look like they look like two of the chromosomes in today's

gorillas and uh chimpanzees well where is this creature oh sorry the creature

is extinct well how do you know this creature had the same CH well because if you take this chromosome you break it in

two pieces and then you take this chromosome you break it and then you put them together you've got human chromosome 2 which is our biological

marker well that's nice you know we have 85% of our genetic code is related to

chickens I don't think big bird is my relative you know same same thing with dogs you know we've got like I don't

know 75% of our DNA is related to dog so you know uh Scooby Do's hello Uncle

Scooby-Doo you know is ridiculous right the look alike it's Tak yeah and that's

the you know so Jason about the scientific process I agree with you 100% but the problem is they're not following

the this process they're not talking about ready or Pastor or Tindle or the previous they talk about Darwin a guy

who ignored all the science and said we evolve from apes because we look like them really you know sit down Charles

right I mean that's basically what this is it's it's ridiculous so you would agree like it it shows Darwinism can

show variation within species but not the creation of a new species I I would say that

it's okay well you know it looks like could be speak you know a wrapper in a

hair are are you know they look alike so they you know they're but but they're

not from the same species yeah visually from theide visually they

look like they're the same species but they're not they can't meet how about this sentence I've heard this before produce Offspring sorry they can't me to

produce Offspring Darwin Darwinism will can explain quite a bit up until we get

to humans and then we're just like I say that's that's a okay I you know just try

it on generally yeah yeah I try it on for size I would generally say that that there there some that there are some

animals that look alike and could have you know U gone through variations over

the course of history um in the same manner but there's other ones that you

know we how many different kinds of fish are there I know a million different kinds of fish I mean I have have a hard

you know have a hard time believing that they would all you know why would they speciate to be I I just I think Darwin

Darwin would was you know when when he ignored when when he never allowed for

the Existence of a Creator to explain life that right away his premise was

invalidated that that's my my view on this he may have he may have been right on on on other aspects but for him to

say because we look like gorillas and chimpanzees therefore we both have a say

you know his idea was there was a great ape in the past this great ape fused their chromosomes to create two

different byproducts of that great ape one of them was the gorillas and chimpanzees of today and the other one

was the human beings and we went our separate ways on the on the evolutionary chain this is his claim and they make

the claim based on the fact that the chromosomes in today's gorillas and

today's chimpanzees some of them can be broken into two pieces stuck together to look

like human chromosome 2 but there's no evidence that that the original ape existed or that that original ape had

those same chromosomes that they're talking about they they're inferring it but it's they infering it yeah but but I

mean what's the alternative right like creation so so this idea that like by

creation so for example like a god it's like I'm going to create a million different species and we were all I mean

because you can see adaptations happening right okay yeah yeah A variation within species yeah yeah

that's right but to create but but to say mankind was cre this is to deny the

existence of a Creator this is the whole point of Darwin the whole point of Darwin was Den to deny the necessity for

a Creator and the whole point of the experiments by Pastor tendal and ready was to show that the necessity of a

Creator so that should have been what the argument was but instead the so-called you know what I call the the

fraternity of fraud or the or or the scientific Community they took it upon

themselves to separate the religion from the science like Darwin did because the other experimenters ready and and Tindle

and and Pastor they they they put the science and religion together and so religion says there has to be a Creator

we see the same thing in our scientific results and Along Comes Darwin kicks it all the curb and said nah you don't need

a you don't need a God we you have to look at some ape and you can see it looks like us so therefore do you know what's funny again you just throw you

throw time at it and they like it's like their magic sauce but just getting back to gods and ancient Greek stuff you know

there was the gods and the Titans right so the Titans were the the the parents of the Gods but the original Titan then

the Zeus of the Titans you know what his name was Kronos you know what Kronos means in Greek time you're literally

just throwing time at it and that's Saturn also yeah well no that would be Zeus I think Zeus would be sat the word

for okay well I know in another language Kronos is a word for Saturn also for time was a timekeeper yeah so you're

right you're right there's a connection the god of time is getting thrown at it imagine a imagine a real scientist

imagine a real scientist having the nerve to say I'm not looking at any of

the religious philosophies that predated our science by thousands I don't care about them I'm only interested in this

little picture here of this I mean it's it's absurd just as it would be absurd for a person who had religious

philosophies to say ah I don't care about that science I only care about the Bible or the or the whatever the Quran

or something like this you know so you you got to you got to work together to get it done it's really that's where the

perspective is missing in today's science they don't cooperate with the religion and that's where a lot of the religious philosophies have a fault

they're trying to ignore the science there's a way to bridge there's a way to bridge them they always were bridged it's only recently that they haven't

been I think yeah bringing them back together would be nice but you know I think that people sort of stay in their

Lane right like with science you want to like there's no point in what what is religion going to give them there's

nothing that can be verified so it's like you know what I mean so they stay in their Lane and they're like which I don't think is a horrible thing like I

think I think the idea of being more open-minded and combining it sure but I like you know science is science whereas

religion is I don't see him as seet you said stay in your lane I you know I understand that but at some but you

can't stay in your lane and ignore the the other lane because that's just is real I mean does anybody think that that

um 200 24 years ago approximately or 2,000

years ago that somebody group of people decided to make up a story about

somebody walking on the earth that could perform Miracles does anybody believe that that actually happened

that some I got nothing better to do today uh you know uh it's a slow day so I'm just going to make up a story about

about this God and then and then somebody else in another part of the world does has the same slow day does the same thing and then you got people

that are fighting with each other uh which are so fighting in the Middle East you know Muslims and Christians whatever

Jews are all fighting each other I don't know why but they are they're all fighting each other but they all agree

that the on the existence of of of a guy named Jesus Christ of course the Jews don't think he was they was a rebel like

you know an ordinary human being Etc right um but but no one doubts the existence of of of so why would somebody

decid to make up the story so if you said to a scientist you know if you mention Jesus Christ he would say or she

would say there's no proof that Jesus Christ existed and it's like so how do these all these people that are fighting

with with each other all come up with the same idea well it's just it's just I think in it's sort of um irrelevant that

he existed in the s in the from the from the point of view of some a scientist trying to figure out like for like you

know you get sick you go to a doctor you don't go to like a witch doctor right like I mean I like which doctor is

religion hey Jason damn you sure but if Jesus didn't exist it would still be

like so this my point is what you I think you were thought you were going to say was that the underlying principles

that that he represents whether he was existed or not

still those principles exist and it's that's why that story 2,000 years later

continues whether we have physical proof that he exists or not because the underlying principles are so important

to humanity so maybe in a sense it was the manifestation of those principles

and that's why we get that same story repeating over and over globally I think you know you said Jesus isn't important

in the in the Jewish philosophy but um you know at at the end of the day if

there was no if there was no Jesus um then I think

think those religions will look remarkably different from how they you know how they actually look even Judaism

wouldn't look the same um a lot of what's happened to the Jews throughout

history is based on the perceived existence of Jesus Christ and other

prophets so I think you know that that but but as a scientist uh you know I'm

just giving an opinion here but as a scientist I have to look at that I have to look at at that and say you know can

can I is this like an actual physical reality that I can relate to that I can understand that I could you know uh you

know put parameters on or whatever I have to do I just I shouldn't just ignore it so I I I I didn't like your

comment about staying in your own lane I think the I think the lane should meet at the intersection and work up but and

and I think at the end of that's going to get us the average person who gets up in the morning goes to work such you

know takes care of the kids and so forth you know what do we say to them do we say you should believe religion or

you should believe science or you should try to understand both and maybe you get a better better picture so I think that's kind of like and you can do it

yourself at home you don't need to have you know you can you can read and and and study and do all that stuff time

permitting but you can do the basics at home yeah so I you know I'm hoping I can get that across to hope we did that

today the three of us here today so yeah so like I I I I want to before we let you go because I know you're you've got

to get going um the uh I just want to say so your book is not out yet your

second book no I'm trying to find I I sent four I think four chapters out uh

and um and and and an introduction but I'm still finalizing it because I I you

know I put it all together and it's all like imp piles good thing good thing we're not filming this interview live in

my basement because you'd see this like you know you know uh uh uh what was that

what was that TV show the guy that had the junkyard and His Son Lamont

you know there was two black guys one of them was a father who ran a junkyard and then there was a Son

Lamont son yes yeah yeah that's my that's my work Zone his work Zone's

clean compared to my work Zone okay I got papers and the things all over everywhere okay so I I'm putting it all

together it's getting done so I'm putting it all together so I really appreciate that you know you you took the time here to you know have me on the

show because it kind of give me a little kick in the ass here and get you know get get stuff organized here I got to

put this in some I've been waiting for you to finish this bloody book for years now I keep waiting and waiting I'm like

well you know actually you know life catch you know life catches up to schedule sometimes right so you got to

prioritize right so I think I mentioned to you before the show about my family said so you know I have to take care of

that first right uh they're dependent on me and my wife so I I got to take care of that first but yeah um I'm getting a

done thanks to you you know contacting me and being persistent about this and it's very nice to meet you too Demetri

yeah very good we it was wonderful but I just wanted to say like that what it's great about this is and it goes back to

the very first thing you said when we sat down about the sending the fragments some of like crashed ships like in your

in your sford and anology yeah like um yeah exactly um that uh bringing all

these fragments of information together and writing a book is like the thing

that we need to solve most in the next Hundred Years cuz the information's out there it it's just fragment M and uh

pulling it all together and putting it into some sort of cohesive form which is what's wonderful about having a podcast because we all bring our own little

fragments of information try to form something here right yeah Jason mentioned about pulling the veil back on

hidden information you know and it's true a lot of it is hidden but there's enough out there yeah to get to get

exactly like like you said you know we can take there's enough pieces out there that they can be put together they can

hide the number system you know people can't hide the number system can hide the dimensions of d

can hide the the radius of jup it's a lot of it's a lot of fragments a lot of information a lot of put people don't

have time for it so I'm hoping with with you know the podcast and other thing people can kind of get an idea that

there's some order going on here and when they got their time they they can check more it's all about Kronos um and

speaking of Kronos uh so we got to we got to wrap it up out of Chronos we're out of Kronos fresh out of Kronos um but

I would say uh so Chris's book his first book Hollow be the name is available I'm

somewhere out now oh is it I have cop well I have online copies okay yeah

but all the physical copies are gone yeah okay yeah so um so and you know we'll let people know when your next

book is out yeah second book's going to be physical copy it's going to be yeah uh the the first book H be the name is

more about it's like an introduction to basic concepts but U filling in the details dotting the eyes and crossing

the teeth out the second book so yeah okay awesome so thanks again for coming Chris welcome guys okay talk soon and

thanks again thank you so much